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Discussion Starter #1
Well you two got your say in today's Denver Post and to Willoughby's credit he wrote about it...even if some of it was written tongue in cheek with an air of skepticism versus the first installment written more like cold hard facts...from the denver post...

http://www.denverpost.com/outdoors/ci_27253657/too-many-mackinaw-is-bad-thing-try-getting


Too many mackinaw is a bad thing? Try getting the lakers to believe that

By Scott Willoughby
The Denver Post

All fishermen are liars except you and me (and sometimes I wonder about you). — Anonymous

Funny thing about fishermen, if we are to believe the title of Lyons fishing author John Gierach's latest book: We're all liars. That is, until someone else steps in to contradict our personal fishing philosophies. Then we're the only ones telling the truth.

Maybe the real reason we're referred to as anglers is that we're all playing a different one. The polite term is "perspective," and each is entitled to his or her own.

In Colorado's cold-water reservoir fishing community, a clash of perspective has been playing out for decades between a group we'll call the lakers — for their advocacy of establishing trophy lake trout fisheries in the state's largest reservoirs — and another we'll call Poindexter, for no good reason beyond a propensity for book smarts and a perceived taste for science-laced Kool-Aid.

The lakers are of the mind-set that lake trout, also known as mackinaw, have potential to serve as Colorado's pre-eminent game fish. The large and typically fast-growing fish found in deep-water reservoirs such as Lake Granby in Middle Park and Blue Mesa near Gunnison can live into their 30s and grow to the state-record size of more than 50 pounds.


Poindexter insists that too many mackinaw is a bad thing, contributing heavily to the decline of another species, kokanee salmon, he calls "critically important," largely because they do such a good job of feeding mackinaw. From Poindexter's perspective, the lake trout population must be culled to save both the kokanees and themselves.

The point was emphasized recently by the continued decline of kokanee populations and egg production at Lake Granby, formerly the biggest source of salmon eggs in Colorado. Although the deficit was made up at other collection sites this past fall, Poindexter sounded the alarm, noting that the manual collection of the fish eggs is "critical for their survival" statewide.

It's possible that Poindexter did not know he was fibbing. His blame of "predatory lake trout, competition from mysis shrimp and parasitic gill lice" for the decline may have been unintentional exaggeration. Urging anglers to keep legal bag limits of lake trout to help balance predator-prey populations at Lake Granby was probably an overstatement. After all, Poindexter is a fisherman too. Just maybe not fisherman enough.

"Why don't you get the real story from an angler's perspective?" Granby laker Steve Penley e-mailed in response to a column noting the decline. "The fact is we don't need Granby's eggs like we used to. The lake has changed and doesn't have the potential any more, due to low nutrients, to be a viable kokanee fishery. The main purpose of the kokanee there is for a cheap feed for the lakers, which is what the majority of anglers come to get and what the economy depends on. We haven't had a viable kokanee fishery for over 20 years."

Penley's perspective is endorsed by Randy Ford of Alpine Fishing Adventures in Silverthorne, a fellow laker who points out that "some of us spend over a thousand days in a five-year period on the water at a specific reservoir," compared with his estimate of "maybe 10 days or so" for scientists tasked with managing far too much water.

"I'm not saying that we know it all, or know more, " Ford said. "But I've learned that I must question authority, think for myself, learn and observe everything I could and gain some of my own thoughts and opinions."

Penley and Ford share the view of a faction of Lake Granby anglers who would like to see the reservoir managed as a trophy lake trout fishery at the expense of the kokanee that help sustain them. Their opinions are widely broadcast on fishing Web forums such as coloradofisherman.com, where they advocate the release of all large lake trout caught in spite of the fishery management research showing that less is more when it comes to growing mackinaw.

"Any big fish that can naturally reproduce and eat lots of small fish is a great thing. Especially when you can keep putting more small fish in," Ford posted recently. "Lake trout are the heroes of every Colorado reservoir they inhabit."

The anglers could be on to something, despite the apparent contradiction by those in the business of turning anecdotal evidence into tangible scientific reports. Either way, they deserve their say. Just one question remains: How do we know who's telling the truth?

Scott Willoughby: swilloughby @denverpost.com or twitter.com/ swilloughby
 

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Goooood ****!
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Wonder what Ewert thinks of that...
 

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He claims lake trout are typically fast growing?? Maybe less then a half inch a year is fast? We know at Granby from 30 years of tagging and recapture information how slow they grow.
Of course the dpw is bias towards the Kokanee, that's their product and what they produce.
We just want the best fishery we can have with the resource.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
I think from that first article the writing is on the wall and Bobco is right...the Death Fleet is coming to Middle Park...
 

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just remember he takes care of Dillon also...wrath of Ewert could be coming big time!!!
 

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If they start death-boating Granby, somehow I think Lakers will show up in Dillon... Just feels like something that might happen...
 

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Discussion Starter #14
One thing is for sure. What was quoted in this article is nothing he hasn't heard or read from us several times.
I figured...just thought if he was lurking like he does from time to time he might chime in...
 

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If they start death-boating Granby, somehow I think Lakers will show up in Dillon... Just feels like something that might happen...
. And pike.

Green mountain reservoir is the perfect example of angler(s) not giving a **** about the CPW and taking matters into their own hands.
 

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You guys are off base, The last thing Ewert wants is a labor intensive netting program or the war that would go with it, there is absolutely no reason for it. Granby isn't Blue Mesa. We like what we have here.
 

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You're probably right there, RL. From all I've read from Jon, netting doesn't seem like the plan...

Still--- if it happens to happen for whatever reason, Dillon will find itself with Lakers somehow.


.And pike


.And probably perch
 

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You guys are off base, The last thing Ewert wants is a labor intensive netting program or the war that would go with it, there is absolutely no reason for it. Granby isn't Blue Mesa. We like what we have here.
Yeah, the economic impact on the Granby area would be huge and since Granby is frequented much more by front range anglers than Blue Mesa..I have a hunch the public outcry would be much greater.

Truthfully, I think Ewert would love to be able to manage Granby for trophy lake trout..but either doesn't know how he can fit feeding lake trout into the budget..or doesn't care to do so..as far as white fish or other forage species go..realistically..they won't take the chance of introducing a species they may not want on down the road. They've discussed it for years and nothing's been done.

But, a strategy of starving lakers...or trying to reduce the numbers of larger lake trout will only give us a lake chalk full of stunted lake trout ...I don't see it ever becoming a destination koke fishery again..The lake would be less than it is today. Like mysis..the lakers are there to stay and you'll never get rid of them..
 

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Why do they think kokanne are the number one priority in ALL the reservoirs that contain both lakers and kokes? What if for example Wolford and Williams Fork could be managed for Kokanne, and GM and Granby for Lakers?

Look at Dillon, they are willing to comprise the kokanne there for something different. Arctic char are being highly revered and heavily stocked in Dillon, They are doing the same thing lakers would do. I am so exited about this because it is already having a positive impact on the fishing at Dillon. There are a huge amount of 16 to 20 inchers in there already and these are the same type of fish that they want taken out of the rest of the reservoirs. Instead of culling them out by raising limits with no trophy protection, and netting and removing them, they are going to make it catch and release with a bag limit of 1 over 20". I complained about the arctic char a couple years ago because all i could catch was 12 inchers and was thinking that was it. After catching a few of them that were over 20" and gorging on fingerlings, I'm not complaining and have high hopes for where the situation seems to be headed. But the logic seems totally opposite of the deeply embedded school of thought about predation of kokanne salmon that has them killing Lake trout all over the place.
 
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